中国人认为西方人是天真吗?
2019-06-10 回复奖励 35761
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原文地址:https://www.quora.com/
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原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.com 翻译:回复奖励 转载请注明出处
论坛地址:http://www.ltaaa.com/bbs/thread-486527-1-1.html

Do Chinese people think Westerners are naive?

中国人认为西方人是天真吗?


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原创翻译:龙腾网 http://www.ltaaa.com 翻译:回复奖励 转载请注明出处
论坛地址:http://www.ltaaa.com/bbs/thread-486527-1-1.html

Hui Wang, M.S. Telecommunications &Finance, Tsinghua University (2003)(清华大学通信与金融理科硕士,2003)
I am a Chinese and 2/3 of my time lived inmainland China, when I was a kid and traveled nowhere, I did believe westsuperior than east at all levels. Then when I traveled to India and Russia(theyare not real western countries), I found that, ok, not only Chinese peoplenaive. And then I traveled to North America, I realized, wow, this is truenaive. And finally I visited Australia and north Europe, I got shocked, isthere bottom line for naive?!

我是中国人,我三分之二的时光生活在中国大陆,当我还是个孩子,没去过什么地方时,我确实认为西方在所有层面都优越于东方。后来我去了印度和俄罗斯(他们不算是真正的西方国家),我发现并非只有中国人才是天真的。然后我去了北美,我意识到,哇,这才是真正的天真。最后我去了澳洲和北欧,我震惊了,天真还有底线吗?

So yes, sometimes and to some extent we dothink westerners naive, let me share one story, I named this story as how couldChinese audit an European company:

所以,是的,有时候,某种程度上我们确实认为西方人是天真的。我来分享一个故事,这个故事的名字叫做《中国人如何审计一家欧洲公司》:



“Well, I cannot judge the nature of yourvisit and I will transfer your application to Danish Immigration Service tomake the judgement and you will get the feedback in 60 working days, duringthat period of time your passport will be held in the Danish embassy !” 60working days??? Well, maybe it’s too far from Beijing to Copenhagen to send thefiles. And I just wait day by day. That was at the beginning of March. And atthe last day of April, I finally got the response from immigration service, Iwas refused to issue the VISA, and the reason is “They believe I am a threat toDanish public policy and internal security”. I contact my Danish colleagues andthey told me they never received any verification request from any Danishdepartments, no telephone, no email, no letter. So I have enough reasons tobelieve they just hold my application and ask nobody about my trip, and justrefused it with an extremely ridiculous reason. And thanks Danish people forgiving me a chance to threaten some countries’ internal security!

“好吧,我无法评判你的访问性质,我将会把你的申请转给丹麦移民服务处,让他们决定,60个工作日后回复你,在这期间你的护照将由丹麦大使馆保管!”“60个工作日???”可能从北京到哥本哈根很远吧。于是我就一天天的等。那是3月初。在4月份的最后一天,我终于从移民服务处获得回应,我被拒签了签证,原因是“他们认为我对丹麦的公共政策和内部安全构成威胁”。我联系了我的丹麦同事,他们说从未从丹麦的任何部门收到过任何的验证请求,没有打电话,没有电子邮件,没有信件。所以我相信他们就是搁置了我的申请,没有征询任何人,就用一个非常荒唐的理由拒绝了我。感谢丹麦人给我机会威胁某些国家的内部安全!

Obviously Danish officers didn’t fullyunderstand the situation or, they just didn’t care 600 Danish people’s job.This story shows the ignorant, arrogant, and extremely inefficient Europepeople, and also a shadow of many other westerners.
So since long time ago I did not believewestern system any more as I used to do.
And by the way, another similar story isjust happening right now, in China it just took me one day to receive myproduct bought online from Guangzhou to Beijing( about 2000 kilometers), andtwo weeks from Chicago to NYC and, it was broken and, another one monthcommunication with seller without any result :(

显然丹麦官员不完全清楚情况,也不关心600个丹麦人的就业。这个故事表明了无知,自大和极度低效的欧洲人,也是很多其他西方人的缩影。
所以很久以前我就不再相信西方体制了。
顺便说一句,另外一个类似的故事也正在发生着,在中国,我网购的产品从广州到北京只需一天就可以收到(大约2000公里),而从芝加哥到纽约需要花2周时间,而且还坏掉了,和卖家沟通了一个月还没有结果。

Alexander Finnegan, J.D. Law, MarxistLeninist(法学博士,马列主义者)
I am not Chinese. But here is myimpression:
Chinese people become frustrated whenWesterners come to Whitesplain to them about the values of Western styleliberal democracy, considering the fact that China is a 5000 year old richculture. My impression is that they see some members of the media, people likeTrump, and others who believe that Western culture is “superior” to Easternculture are indeed naive. The reason is because if they understood the goodthings about Chinese culture they wouldn’t so readily try to change Chineseculture. This gives some Westerners a kind of tone deafness that makes dialoguedifficult. Because you have to come at someone with a certain level of opennessto make meaningful dialogue.

我不是中国人。但我的印象是:
由于中国是一个有着5000年历史的丰富文化,当西方人来到他们面前谈论西式自由民主的价值观时,中国人感到沮丧。我的印象是,他们看到一些媒体人,像特朗普这样的人,还有一些认为西方文化比东方文化“优越”的人时,他们确实觉得这些人是幼稚的。原因是,如果他们了解中国文化的好,他们就不会那么轻易地试图改变中国文化。所以中西之间的对话会变得困难。因为只有心态开放的情况下才可能进行有意义的对话。

Some Westerners are also naive to believethat they can attack another country and force Western style democracy on thepeople and they will appreciate it. This was tried in Iraq and it was adisaster. Neoconservatives are naive. They lack an appreciation for the nuancesand complexities of other cultures and people. It also displays a level ofmoral self-righteousness and paternalism.

某些西方人还天真的认为他们可以攻击其他国家,将西式民主强加在其他国家身上,以为这样他人会感激自己。在伊拉克尝试过了,是一个灾难。新保守主义者是天真的。他们不懂得欣赏其他文化和人民的细微差别与复杂性。这也显示了他们的道德伪善和家长作风。



Johnny Chao
You do realize technology leapfrogs, likeAfrica skipped the landline phase of infrastructure development, or even thingslike 2G? Or china skipped the whole credit card infrastructure aspect ofpayment processing and went straight to mobile payment/wallet. Don’tunderestimate the power of 1 billion people on a continent rich of resourceswith a huge young labour force hungry for a better life after centuries ofoppression. And you’re also forgetting the chance of a collapse in the west.
Maybe you’re 90 years old so you definitelywon’t see it, but for people younger than 30–40 years old, they will.

你可知道技术跳跃,非洲跳过了基建发展的固线阶段,甚至跳过了2G。而中国跳过了整个的信用卡支付阶段,直接来到移动支付和钱包。不要低估了非洲,拥有10亿人口,资源丰富,巨大的年轻劳动力,在经历了几个世纪的压迫后他们想过上更好的生活。而且你也忘了西方崩溃的可能性。
可能你已经90岁了,所以你肯定看不到那一天的来临了,但是三四十岁以下的年轻人会看到的。

Nelson Buddison
If that’s the case I would suggest ourfellow Chinese friends stop moving to the West and stealing inferior Westerntechnologies. Learn a superior African language and move to Africa. There areway toooo many Chinese dreaming of moving to the West the Western world can nolonger handle all of them. Africa should come to our rescue ... indeed lol

如果是这样的话,我建议我的中国朋友们不要移民去西方和窃取劣等的西方技术了。去学习更优越的非洲语言并搬去非洲吧。有太多中国人想要移民去西方,西方世界已经人满为患了。非洲来救救我们把。哈哈

Johnny Chao
The funny thing is, even though you stolethe land from natives and murdered them, now you consider this your land/homeand think you have the right to tell anyone to not come/leave the place.
Guess what, you have no power to stop/startanyone from coming to your country, the democracy doesn’t work.
And in terms of people “dreaming” to moveto the west, your scope of thought is just too small, africa,india, china,south east asia add up to 4+ billion people, the bottom 5-10% who have very fewoptions locally would definitely want to move over, and that is 200- 400million, so you think it’s a lot. But for every person that wants to move,there’s 3–4 that don’t. That’s like saying there’s all these expats in chinatrying to teach english because they would be otherwise unemployed socialoutcasts back home and that means the west wants to move to china.

可笑的是他们从土著那里窃取了土地,还杀死了他们,现在你认为这土地是你们的了,以为自己有权要求他人不来或者离开。
你没有权力阻止任何人来你们国家,民主没有用。
就人们梦想搬去西方这一点,你的思维也太狭隘了,非洲,印度,中国和东南亚人口加起来40多亿,只有那底层的5-10%在本地待不下去没得选择才想移民去西方,那就是2-4亿人,所以你觉得这很多。每一个想移民的人,对应的就有3-4个不想移民,这就好比说所有来中国教英语的外国人是因为在自己国内混不下去了才来中国,而这意味着西方人都想移民中国。



Enric Zheng
There are good sides of western votingsystem and capitalism - however, many westerners seem to neglect the problemsalong with them.

西方选举制度和资本主义有好的一面,然而很多西方人貌似忽视了其不好的一面。

Monica Lee
Agree with u man. Some westerners are tooself-righteous to see the good point of others. Big good e.g. Donald Trump -who likes to trumpet around his ideals.

赞同,有些人太自以为是了,看不到他人的优点。比如川普,就喜欢吹嘘。

Richard Hsu
Too young, too simple, too naive.

太年轻,太简单,太单纯。
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